Unlocking six-figure success: Findings from our 2025 Growth Guide

Akua: In today’s episode, you are going to see that there is no wrong way to success. Honeybook recently launched their 2025 growth guide, which shares key insights of what the top marketing and creative consultants are doing to hit six figures and beyond in their business. So today on the podcast, we brought back two people who know a thing or two about building successful businesses.

Business coach Candace Coppola and pricing strategist Dr. Michael Tattanetti joins us to break down these insights from the growth guide and strategies they are implementing to continue building their multi six figure businesses. You are going to leave this conversation inspired with so many ideas of how you can grow in your business.

But before we happen today’s episode, make sure to head to our show notes to get your digital hands on our growth guide, because it is filled with so much impactful information. Let’s get into the episode. Hey everyone. This is your host, Akua Konadu, and you’re listening to the Independent Business Podcast.

More people than ever are working for themselves and building profitable businesses in the process. So on this show, I get to sit down with some of the most influential authors, entrepreneurs, and creators to break down the science of self made success so that you can achieve it too.

Michael, Candice, how are we doing today? Good. Excited to have this conversation about the Growth Guide. Thank you I know. So, so excited to have both of you on here. And I was very strategic in this because one, both of you guys have very fun, no BS kind of personalities that I just love. And two, both of you guys have built such successful businesses in different ways.

And with the Intel from the growth guide, I really wanted to bring you guys both just to really showcase to business owners that there’s more than one way to do this. And I’m just really excited to have both of you here. So thank you.

Dr. Michael Tatonetti: Yeah. Thanks for having us.

Akua: Yes, absolutely. So one of the main things that was in the growth guide is that we just talked about diversified revenue streams.

And so Candace, I really want to start with you. Can you highlight just some of your top revenue streams in your business and what percentage of your income does that come from passive sources?

Candice Coppola: Oh gosh, I would say a large percentage of my income comes from passive sources. My revenue streams range from affiliate marketing to digital products that I offer.

I do a membership, I have courses, and then I have some one to one client work in a group setting. So the majority of my income comes from digital products, things that are very passive that people can purchase when they’re ready to buy and my business makes money from those passive purchases. So I would say probably 65 percent of my revenue is purely passive.

Akua: Okay. So really also, I’m going to put a shameless plug. You guys, Candace was on last year where we did our very first live interview and we talked about, did a deep dive into her affiliate marketing because she’s HoneyBook’s top affiliate earner. And so you guys, I’m no, I’m going to just put that back in there.

Y’all y’all better go listen. If you want to get started in affiliate marketing, cause you just said it makes a good chunk of her income now. Okay. Go and listen to that episode because it was so, so good and so impactful. And so Michael, what about you? Have you seen with, what are some of your diversified revenue streams, if you have any?

Dr. Michael Tatonetti: Yeah. Yeah. So we do ours are more hands on cause we’re B2B. So we’re serving organizational clients. I would say that our direct consulting services are a good 80 percent of our revenue. And then about 10 percent per year is speaking. And then I would say about maybe 10 to 15%. I would say we have about five or so percent.

That’s more what I would call passive income, which is our book. So we publish the book and that kind of sells. But the interesting thing there is that the book has helped us close way more consulting deals. So we’ve gone three to four X in revenue this year, since the book came out. And then we also use the book in other strategic ways for marketing strategy, opt ins, things like that.

Uh, and then the last thing I’ll say there is I still feel like even the consulting income is kind of passive in a way, because even though it is a direct service, I’ve been strategic in hiring. So the amount. Um, client work that I do is not even 10 percent of what our firm does for the client. So ensuring that I have staff in place so that they’re doing what they need to do.

And I can collect my salary and do what’s needed, but really stay to my zone of genius and not in the weeds.

Akua: Oh my gosh, I love that. And there’s just so much strategy packed in that. I’m really curious to know, how has you launching a book led to more, like I’m so interested to know more of a deep dive into that.

Dr. Michael Tatonetti: Yeah. So for us, it’s, it really comes down to establishing authority for me, writing a book, it wasn’t just about doing it for the sake of it. It was, we put our framework and what we do. So we do pricing strategy and consulting, and we wrote out our entire framework into the book. And what that did was for those organizations that.

Maybe he said, Hey, we need help with our pricing. We know that it’s off, but we’re not sure how to get there. It proved the concept. They were able to read the book or read our articles in advance. So when they got to the sales call, they were already sold. So our close rate has gone up. We already had a high one.

I would say about 60 percent prior to this year of our sales close because we use honey book and we have that data. But now this year we’re at more like 85, probably percent. So it’s, it’s much. Uh, much warmer leads, I would say, coming in because of the book. Um, the other thing that we did was we repurposed the book into 50 different articles that became blogs on our website.

Um linkedin articles for our newsletter. So we’re basically giving it away for free and we give the pdf version away for free as our opt in because for us It’s all lead gen and now we’re playing around with google’s notebook lm feature and turning each of those into a little book AI generated podcast episode.

So that can be new content for next year. So we’re currently toying with that behind the scenes. So we’re using ours and not only for passive income, which is great. I love getting my royalty check every month from Amazon and Barnes and Noble and all that. But it’s also a very strong lead gen in marketing.

Effort as a b2b pharo

Akua: Yes, oh my gosh, I love that so much. I think it just speaks to again, like always When we always hear this an entrepreneur what we don’t always hear this But I used to hear this all the time of like you don’t want to give too much away, right? Otherwise, how will people work with you and it’s like you you’re giving everything away and people are still booking with you and I think again, it’s just really it just goes to show of like leading with service first, I think is first and foremost of just how it can really take you far in your business and Candace for you, because, and I loved the contrast between you two of the different types of, uh, revenue streams.

Like they’re so different for both of you. And so a question that I’m wondering, especially for business owners, as they’re wanting to lean more into diversifying their revenue streams, like for Candace, for you, how do you find like what truly works for you?

Candice Coppola: Well, I think first you have to think about what works for your customers.

And if you put them at the center of whatever you create, then you’ll likely create something that they want to purchase. So it’s about thinking about what do my customers need and what could I sell to them, or what could I put out there? That they would be able to then take and do on their own or use on their own so that you don’t have to have too much of a hand In supporting them after they download it or they see it or they read it It really is a hands off approach.

I mean what makes passive income so Exciting is, is that you don’t have, you create it and then you market it, but you don’t have to handhold it all the time and, you know, jump on a call. And there’s not a lot of one to one work. It works for itself. And so it’s important for you to think about, well, what maybe problem does my customer have that they’d like to solve?

And maybe they’d like to solve less expensively, or they’d like to solve it on their own, that I could create a passive product or a passive service around. That would allow them to do it. That’s a great place to start, but there might be something that you’re using internally in your business. That may be businesses like yours might also benefit from.

This is a really quick way to get into creating a digital product that can then be passive. Maybe you created a framework or a process or a workflow. Maybe there’s something you created in honey book, like a smart file or something that you’re using that has great conversion, you could essentially sell that to people in your industry who were looking for that shortcut.

Akua: Yes. I love that so much. I think that it’s, my thing is, is that when we think about diversifying our revenue streams, we make it into this bigger thing, but it’s like, there’s so many smaller and easier ways to do that, that you just may not even think of. Like I was teaching in a workshop a couple of weeks ago and somebody was like, Oh cool.

You should take like this small piece of your workshop and turn it into a digital product. And Thank you. I did not like, you know what I mean? I just, I didn’t even think of that. And I was like, Oh my gosh, I think it just speaks to the point of like, work with what you already have. Like you already have the skills and the knowledge.

So is there something that you can already take and turn it into something that can be more passive? And I love too, how you brought up with even honey book, like our template gallery, right? Like now people, uh, business owners can now leverage templates and being able to sell them to make more passive income, you know?

So I think it just, again, really highlighting the skills, the things that you’re good at, you don’t have to build. You know what I mean? Of course you got to put in some work 1000%, but there’s, you all, you already have the foundation to, to do the things that you’re wanting to do. And so Michael, is there anything that you wanted to add as well?

Dr. Michael Tatonetti: No, I actually want to echo what Candice said, which is listening to your audience. You know, at the end of the day, um, I think sometimes we can begin with ourselves and say, this is the type of business that I want to build. And I think that’s important. And we talk about that on this podcast a lot, but we also have to have, Knowledge that the business is sustainable and it’s meeting a market need.

So if I prefer a business where I’m running, you know, uh, courses or one day intensives or whatever the model is, if that’s not how the people want to receive that knowledge, you have to be aware. And then you might need to pivot what you’re doing. So you have to lead with how do they want to receive this information and get to know your audience really, really well, and then decide, okay, how can I show up and serve in a way that makes sense and brings in the amount of revenue that I

Akua: Yes.

Oh my gosh. Love that. And so I really want to pivot the conversation a little bit because, which is still linked to what you guys just said. But one thing that was highlighted in the growth guide that I found really interesting was about strong client loyalty, right? So high earners generate over half of their revenue from repeat clients who only acquire 26 percent of their time.

Now, Candace. Your community ride for you. For

Candice Coppola: sure they do because I’m, I’m constantly trying to find ways to meet their needs. Also, I teach them that it’s easier to sell to an existing client. Then it is to acquire a new one. It’s easier. It’s also cheaper when you think about client acquisition costs and how much you spend in your marketing.

And if you really show up for your clients and solve a problem for them, that often unlocks another next level problem that you could potentially solve. You don’t have to solve. So I don’t want to force you to do something that is not within your zone of genius. But there is this opportunity to solve their next level problem.

And then also to think not even next level, but what comes before they might come to me for this problem? Is there something that I should be solving before they even find me that could help them find me in a better position? So there is, for me, I would say the majority of my business is repeat customers, and I was able to create this by understanding what my product ladder was.

When I, when I launched digital products and I launched this style online business, I had one product and over the years that has grown to meet the needs of people at different points in different stages where they would need my help. But I started in one place and I kept myself open to creating products at different stages.

I’m going to be talking about the next step in the transition stages because I know that the easiest way to make more money in your business is to sell to an existing client, even if it’s not passive, even if it’s just finding a service that you can offer at a next step. And I’ll also tell you that a lot of times we don’t.

Really realize how much our clients want to work with us more. And they want like, what’s next? Like, how can we work together on something else? And if your clients are saying that to you, then it means like, they’re like, Hey, like, what are you, how can we do something? What can you offer? I want to work with you.

I want to give you my money. Like, here is my credit card. How can we keep this relationship flowing? I really enjoyed the process. And so you should start listening to that and looking for ways to

Akua: work with your clients more. You were just dropping so many gems within that but one thing I just really want to highlight is what I’ve noticed with you is that you are anticipating Your audience’s needs before they even realize that they need you, right?

Like, and I think that’s a skill that not a lot of people have. And so I think that’s a really important thing for us as business owners to really be thinking about as, as we’re creating new products or new services, adding things into our product ladder, really number one, always putting your target audience first, but you already built something.

Okay, great. Now leverage that and that data to be like, okay, what. Would they need from me next? Like, what is the next steps? Like, you know what I mean? And I think that’s just such an important thing to remind yourself of how do we anticipate our audience’s needs? And Michael, what about you? You also too have a very strong client loyalty and I know you have systems in your business too.

And so what about you, what strategies have you been implementing where you have really seen a huge difference?

Dr. Michael Tatonetti: Yeah. So I think, um, part of it is giving it time because when you’re talking about the services end of things, they may come to you for a really big service, but then they may not need you again for two years, three years, maybe once per year at best.

So giving space, giving time, it can take time to build up your book if you will. But we do offer other things that they can choose from. So a lot of our clients may first come to us with a book. For a training, maybe I’m training their board or their staff on something or speaking at a conference for them.

But then they’re like, okay, great. Now what else can you help us with this project? Or we offer a one day intensive. So our offer model is basically we’ll do speaking. We do a one day intensive, or we do a multi month project, usually six months with them to price the. Uh, one to three products. And so typically they’re coming back to us and saying, okay, what’s next?

From there, what we found is some clients ask for a retainer model. So I’ve created that for some where they say, can we just have you on retainer for four hours a month? Meet for one hour a week, get your feedback on what we’re doing. Or some have asked us to do additional, okay, can you do a deeper dive training?

Can you come in for. I do not have to do anything. So I am very, uh, what I do is I balance us having strong systems for what we already do in templates so that we’re not losing anything on the and creating everything from scratch for every client and saying, okay, is this worth us doing this additional little thing over here?

Sure. We can do it easily. Like what’s the effort against the ROI that we’re going to get as a firm and does that even make sense for us? But it does. A lot of our clients are very loyal. They recommend other people. That’s another great feature is kind of tracking how they heard about us and seeing that repeat clients and vendor or client referrals are way up for us now as well.

Which really helps with your booking rates. So treating people well, Akua, you say this, but focusing on service, you know, at the end of the day, we are providing something, whether it’s a product, a one to one service, a group service, but we’re serving people and trying to help them reach some type of an end goal and making sure that we do that well.

Akua: Yes, I love that so much and I really want to just talk about product ladders really quickly because I feel like Obviously you guys have been in business for years And I feel like a lot of times business owners who maybe may not be at that stage yet Can find it a little bit overwhelming? And especially when you’re like listing all of the things that you do and you’re like what where why and how?

So for you guys, what? piece of advice do you have for business owners as they’re looking to really expand their offers in different ways? Whether that is, you know, uh, affiliate marketing or leaning more into speaking or launching a new offer, or what is one piece of advice that business owners can take in regards to like creating their, their product ladder?

Candice, I’ll have you go first.

Candice Coppola: I think the best thing you can do is look for a natural extension to what you already offer that your clients might even be asking you for, and develop that, and test it out with one or two clients if it’s one to one work. Even if it’s something that you hope to be passive, you can test it out with some existing clients to get some testimonials and feedback, and then let it grow from there.

Really, when we think about repeat customers and your product ladder, everything should naturally kind of flow. It doesn’t always, and that’s okay, but we do want it to flow because we want to be on someone’s journey for as long as we can in serving them and supporting them because we know they’ll come back to us when they have another problem.

And so if you can think about what’s a natural extension, either going up. Or going down in my business that can serve people at a different stage before they would normally find me. How can I layer that into my business would probably be my, my, the best place to start. Love that. Michael, what about you?

Dr. Michael Tatonetti: Yeah, I would echo that. And the only thing that I would really add is also lean into then what inspires you, that’s where you have some freedom. If you have multiple options. So by listening first to Candice’s point and saying, okay, what else is needed? But, um, you know, as someone with ADHD for me, I usually also go, okay, how can I lean into what I’m inspired by and what I feel like doing?

Because how many times are we sitting at our desk? You know, begrudgingly working on something. So I think, where do I feel excited? Like I’ve had a big inspiration this past week to redo our entire backend in our project management system. We’ve been working on it for like a month, but I just went to town on it this past week and knocked it out.

The same thing with client facing work. If I feel like speaking more, but I also know when I have seasons where I’m like, Ooh, I have enough speaking books. Can I do, can I create some new articles or, uh, can I create a new download, you know, as an opt in or so kind of, I would, I would add, I would say yes, starting with your clients, how can you meet them where they’re at?

And then I would also add lead into where do you feel most creative and inspired so that you get it done because ideas are great, but action is way better.

Akua: Yes. Oh my gosh. Both of y’all just. Mm hmm. Mm hmm. But another thing is to the fact that you brought that up, Michael, is because this was also a key stat in the growth guide is that 72 percent of businesses started was as a way to pursue a passion, followed obviously by desires for flexibility and career autonomy.

And I think again, it just goes to the fact of like, whatever it is that you’re doing, you have to have the passion behind it in order to run a successful business because things are going to get really hard. And I think again, to the point of like, there are so many areas in our businesses that we just don’t.

Enjoy doing and so it’s like when you know the highs and like when you’re being cheered on and it’s those those smaller moments where like I had to do my bookkeeping today, you know, or you know, I have to like do my taxes those like those That just make it like, Ooh, but those are the moments that matter.

Right. As well, that just like really help to push you to keep going of like, if you have that passion there, this doesn’t feel like work, no matter what it is that you’re doing in business. And so I love that. What fuels both of you as entrepreneurs, Michael, I’ll have you answer first.

Dr. Michael Tatonetti: Yeah. So I’m going to be selfish and, and talk about the things that inspire me first, which is freedom of time, freedom of money, freedom of location.

Those three for me. Are why I’m in business now, why I do what I do in the niche that I work with is because I care about the field that I’m in and I’m really passionate about it, but I could have a nine to five and work in that field and make the same impact. So the difference for me is that as an entrepreneur, as a business owner is about the freedom of time, money and location, knowing that I can work when I want.

If I want to push, I mean, I rarely push off a meeting, but if I just need a day, I can, or if I want to change a deadline, I can, if I want to have a slow month or whatever that looks like travel, you know, I have kids, like whatever I want to do, I can fit all that in. And I choose if I work three really long days, like I am this week.

And then I’m taking the second half of the week off to go, you know, work Run around with friends, or if I want to work, you know, three hours a day or four hours, whatever I want. So for me, that’s the, that’s the why behind running a business, not just helping the people that I help in the way that I do, but why do I do this?

And then I’ve also found it’s really fun. I always had plans of being a solopreneur with just one VA, but now that we’re up to a full time team of five, I’m finding that I’m really enjoying. Hiring people, knowing that I’m making such a difference in their life with how much I pay them against the work they do and the type of work environment that we have, that it’s like a really healthy one, they would say, and they love working for me.

And like that, that is something that gets to kind of course correct a lot of what goes wrong in corporate America.

Akua: Love that. Candace, what about you?

Candice Coppola: Well, I would echo what Michael said. I feel very similarly. You know, I started my business because I had an idea. I wanted to become a wedding planner and I just was so excited at the thought of being able to do it for myself.

I was in a corporate job that I hated. I was treated poorly. I could see around me, the folks working that job hated their work. And I just didn’t want to live like that. I was young enough to where I felt like. This is do or die for me. I have a choice to make. This is my time to either try to become an entrepreneur and start this crazy wedding planning business or accept the fact that this is probably going to be my, my fate in my career.

I’ll be working in an office somewhere. And I decided that I was going to try because it was at the right point in my life to do that. And over the years, I think I get most gratification from being able to fully express myself and have fun. Full and complete control over my life, over my money, over my time, my relationships, how I spend my time, the things I get to work on and who I get to work on things with from a business standpoint, it’s the impact I get to create impact in my community.

And it has huge ripples. Because why we all started a business is the same reason that the businesses I get to serve, they started their business.

Akua: And I

Candice Coppola: get to support people in making decisions and living out their meaningful life, leaving corporate America, if that’s what they want to do, leaving a cubicle, leaving a toxic work environment and creating their own dream.

And that impact is what gets me up every day. It’s what makes me work long nights because entrepreneurship is not easy. I work a lot. Somebody asked me, they’re like, Oh, how many hours are you working these days? And I’m like, I don’t know, 80 always working because I love it so much. And I love serving people so much.

It makes the hours that I put into it, which by the way, are a lot of fun. I really enjoy my job. It’s, it’s basically my life. I love it, but it makes it worth it because it has such a tremendous impact on the lives of the women and the folks that I get to support. And to me, that’s the most gratifying thing is seeing someone else Find their own measure of success.

Akua: Oh my gosh. I just love both of your sentiments, both everything that you shared. And I think again, there’s obviously all of us starting our business. It’s very similarly, like both. Very different journey. All three of us have very different journeys, how we landed into entrepreneurship. But the core reason as to why we did it, why we decided to take the leap is the same.

And I think, again, it’s really highlighting the impact that you’re making, because sometimes when you feel what you feel you’re doing is ordinary, it’s extraordinary to somebody else. And I think that’s something that I always remind myself, because especially as business owners, as we grow, as we are starting to do things regularly, you kind of just.

Um, and I just feel like, you know what I mean, like sometimes it can be easy to really lose that scene where you’re just like, you’re just on that, you’re just doing the same thing every day. And so I think again, it’s just really reminding yourself of the impact. And so like, even for me, like I have these like folders and stuff saved on my computer of like testimonials, like things that people have shared that how I have impacted them.

So there are days where I’m just like, I don’t know what I’m doing or maybe this isn’t really important or I don’t know if this is gonna make an impact. I always go back and look at those things and I’m like, girl, let’s, let’s get it together. Let’s work on that mindset and like keep pushing forward. And I love that so much of just the passion that both of you guys have and how you’re serving business owners.

And I think it’s just something that we need to continuously, continuously remember, like even if you can serve just one person and make that impact to where they can now live out their dreams, like keep pushing forward. And so thank you both of you for sharing that. That was amazing. Yes, I’m really interested to talk about retainers because Michael, I know you have retainer clients Candace.

Do you do anything on retainer or no?

Candice Coppola: Not really. I mean, I have a mastermind where people have me on retainer to support them In a way, but no, I don’t really work on retainer With clients. No, but it’s

Akua: at

Candice Coppola: least

Akua: a mastermind. There was a little something though, right? And I think one thing that was really interesting in the growth guide was that top earners average about 45 000 annually From retainer agreements with some earnings significantly more.

So I actually grew my business as well, based all off of retainer clients. And I do believe that as a business owner, like if you cannot find a way to have a retainer client, you, they’re like potentially like leaving money on the table. And so for Michael, for you, what has been the major piece in your strategy in your business that has led you to getting more retainer clients?

Dr. Michael Tatonetti: So I would say, well, first I would actually say, I just feel like this is important as we talk about retainer, but in general, all these findings are so rich and so great, but every finding is not going to apply to every business model. And I share that knowing that Candace doesn’t really do retainer I do, but it’s so minimal.

So as we talk about all these strategies, even Candace and I do like, So I’ve been working with a lot of people who have very different strategies, but have very successful businesses. So keep that in mind as we’re sharing our tips, that’s what works for our specific. Don’t feel like you have to do all the things or that if it doesn’t work, that you don’t have a great business idea.

Like, I just feel like that’s important to say. So for me, retainer clients are usually those who have already gone through at least a six month engagement with me. So we’ve Worked on something, you know, they’ve been a client. We usually have up to 10 clients at a time for six months. And so we shoot for 20 per year.

And then for those select few who I just, you know, really love and that really need our help, because part of this is the interesting thing. Um, you know, Part of this, we all talk as well about not wanting to work in corporate for bad, you know, environments. Part of the good thing about running your own business is you can, at any point, choose to stop working with the client or stop selling to someone.

So you get to fire that client, if you will, and choose who you want to work with. So for those that I really love that I bond with, who respond, who do the work, right, like we’re, we’re, we’re in sync and getting done what needs to be done. Um, for them, we’ll offer a retainer. And usually it’s more of that.

They want us to meet with them once or twice a month to check in. Or if they have something that’s going out, they want us to look at. So in our model, it doesn’t make too much sense to have everyone on retainer. It’s more as they’re rolling things out and they want additional support. But for other, you know, like social media managers, I could see retainer because they’re doing monthly work.

Even for a photographer, I could see if you’re going to bulk in annual photo shoots and back to school photos or whatever, depending on what you shoot. But if you’re a wedding photographer, not so much, that’s a one time, you know, maybe two or three times in your lifetime purchase, but you’re not putting that on retainer because you’re not planning on using them again at the first wedding.

So just know that it kind of depends, but we do use the retainer model. For me, it’s a great way to keep my loyal clients in. Constant communication with us, provide them with support and make sure that they’re set up for success. And then they come back for something deeper when they need it.

Akua: I love that you shared, like highlighted how different your businesses are, because that’s the main reason why I wanted both of you guys here is truly just because you guys have built such bad ass businesses and I’ve done it in a way that in a way that works for you and you have forged your own path.

And I just love that. And for Candice, even though, okay, retainers just doesn’t play a big role in your business. How. Because you have a loyal, like, despite that though, you still have like repeat people that are coming back to you often. And I feel like you like client experience. I’ve heard like the client experience you provide is just so damn good.

And so for you, what advice do you have in terms of. Which you kind of touched on it a little bit early, but just again, like even having that repeat where it could lead to something.

Candice Coppola: That’s a great question. I have a lot of repeat clients. A lot of clients extend their time with me and they want to continue working because there’s still work to be done.

And these are at the highest level,

Akua: but

Candice Coppola: as we’re talking about retainer payments, I mean, I don’t have anybody on retainer, but I do have a membership that people are in every single month. Some people have been in for 37 months. They have been a faithful member. Of our membership. And I think that’s something to say about basically having me on retainer at this point to be their support system when they have a question or there’s something they need, you know, first, you have to make an option available.

People need to know that this is available to them in some form or fashion. If you’re looking to it. Put them on retainer or have retainer reoccurring revenue in some way. They need to know what their options are and how those options can benefit them. And I do think the client experience plays a large role in them choosing to be on retainer with you.

And they have a positive experience when it feels supported, they feel nurtured, They may be surprised and delighted, or they get more than what they expected. They don’t want to look elsewhere. I think we’ve all been in that scenario where you hire a service provider, you hire somebody, they give you such great service.

You’re like, I don’t like, could you do everything for me? Could you brush my hair? Could you clean my house? Like what else can we do together? Cause you’re so great. I don’t want to go anywhere else. And that’s because of really great customer service. So if you make customer service also. A cornerstone of your business, which P.

S. It should be, it should be, but if you really invest in having positive customer service, unreasonable customer service, which is something we’re really trying to do in my business and even get better at, we’re not perfect, but You know, reading the book on reasonable hospitality, which everybody has read at this stage or should read if you haven’t.

It talks about providing an experience. That’s just unreasonably hospitable. We don’t often have that as we engage with the business. But when we do, We become a customer for life. And when you have that customer, they want to be on retainer. They want to pick your brain or they want your service. They just want you next to them.

And I think for me, having hired people on retainer, it’s about knowing they’re, they’re not going anywhere. Like we’re working together, whether I use a lot of you this month or just a little, I have you in my back pocket.

Akua: Yes. I love that so much. And I was just thinking that too, of like somebody who I have on retainer, like she ain’t going nowhere.

Like, I love you. Like, literally no. And so, and she’s the person that does all my blogs and I love her and her work. And like, and I think again, it just speaks to the fact of the service that you’re providing that client experience, really leaning into that and making that a cornerstone of your business.

And I love, again, like retainer can look different, but Looks different among all business owners. Right. And I think, again, I was able to get retainer clients truly by echoing the similar sentiment of the client experience that I was providing, where they were like, okay, you’re not going to go anywhere, we’re going to keep you and extend the contract or, you know, whether it’s a membership or whatever, as long as you’re there to provide that support for business owners and letting them know, like, no matter what it is that you’re going through, I’m here to support you.

I’m here to solve your problems and make your life easier as ever. A business owner. And so just looking ahead, another thing that I found really interesting, the growth guide is by 2027, it is projected that 50 percent of the U S workforce will be independent. So hearing that stat, what do you think the future of entrepreneurship looks like?

Candace, I will have you go first.

Candice Coppola: Oh, my goodness. I mean, the future looks bright. If those, if those stats pan out, it’d be amazing. It would be incredible to see so many people chasing their dreams and to have an economy that’s driven by passion and purpose. I feel like as a society, it will just enhance all of our interactions.

We’ll be happier. We’ll be healthier. I worry who’s going to work at some of the businesses that we might frequent outside of that. There is a side hustle economy, right? No, I think it’s fantastic. I mean, I think it goes to show how much people are craving having a say in what their life looks like and actually being able to make that a reality.

And what I love is, is that, I mean, this is, isn’t a shameless plug. It’s true that. Tools like HoneyBook make being an independent business owner so much easier and they help you streamline your processes and provide such a great service for your clients, a great customer service and ease of use. It makes sense of things that an entrepreneurship or just hard to understand if you don’t have a background in business, which I think most people don’t.

Akua: So I

Candice Coppola: think the future looks really bright. If we could all just wake up in the morning and have like our favorite morning and then do our favorite work, wouldn’t we all be so happy? I mean, the email in our inbox. We’ll find us. Well, it will be like, I’m doing good. When people say,

Akua: I hope this email finds you.

I always say, please don’t. I’m like, I wish you didn’t find me.

Candice Coppola: There’s a great audio of a song and it’s like, um, I know there’s an email that hopes to find me well, and then it repeats over and over. And then the hook is, I hope it doesn’t find me. It’s hilarious. It’s so hilarious. Cause it’s so true.

Akua: So, so true.

Michael, what about you?

Dr. Michael Tatonetti: No, I agree. I think it would be great if we had more people, whether it’s freelancers that are doing their things solo, whether they’re building a small team or scaling up, whatever that looks like for everybody. I think that’s awesome. I also think that what I would add. Is the importance then of education around business, business structure, finances, bookkeeping, accounting.

And it sounds like, Oh my gosh, this is so much. And it is when you are running something, whether it’s freelance or a small business, however you are structured, it, there is an added element because you are running a business. A business. You are not just the employee who gets the clock in and clock out.

So it’s so important to learn these things from peers. It’s important to connect with other people that do similar things to what you do and learn out of all of these things in the growth guide, what do they do? And you’ll probably find that. Different people do different things in different ways, but what are the opportunities?

What are the options? And I’ll also give a plug that this is why things like politics matter, no matter how you go, it’s so important because our world is really built around nine to fives. And as this change happens, I think we’re going to see more structural changes in policy from both sides. So I think it’s so important if you’re us based to and wherever you are to be plugged in and.

How do these things impact? How do tax laws impact? How do healthcare laws impact all of that? Your ability to run a business. So, uh, yeah, I think getting education and if you want to take that leap, go for it, like there’s opportunity.

Akua: Oh my gosh. Every time I meet somebody, I’m thinking about, I’m like, do it.

Start the business, start a business.

Candice Coppola: Like people,

Akua: I’m always like do it, but I think, but I love Michael too, where you highlighted of like, that’s going to force. I don’t know how many times we’ve said this on the show of like, our current infrastructure right now, our government just does not support small business owners.

Well, like I even think of my own journey, how hard it was for me to initially get health insurance. That wasn’t even on like the top of my list. When I first started my business, you’re just trying to find your first client. And I just remember my mom said like a month or two later, she’s like, what about health insurance?

And I was like, what about it? I didn’t even think about it.

Dr. Michael Tatonetti: Yes. Health insurance, retirement account, retirement for that, everything. And then knowing if you should be an S corp, a C corp or sole proprietor, all these, there’s so many things that the podcast has hit on over the seasons, but yeah, it’s going to impact.

So, so be willing to advocate for what you need so that we can create an inclusive economy for everybody where everyone has the opportunity to To jump because to Candace’s point, who’s going to have opportunity. Who’s not, we don’t want it to just be people who have a spouse or a partner that has a nine to five for that insurance and those benefits.

We all want to be able to make decisions and not be locked in. We all want to be able to choose and chase our purpose and what’s driving us. So let’s make the world a better place for entrepreneurs because it’s on the rise and it’s here.

Akua: Yes. And also let’s make the world a better place for entrepreneurs on the rise.

Should be on a t shirt. Just saying passive income, Michael, for you.

Healthy. Wanted to add to that as well.

Candice Coppola: No, I love that. And I fully agree. I fully agree with everything that Michael said. I really, I mean, it’s exciting to think that, you know, over half of Americans would be able to work for themselves and launch their own business and apply their own trade in some way and make their own money.

I mean, I just, it really, I, sitting here, Gosh, um, how many years in business over 15 years in business sitting here? I can tell you that this is that, that me sitting on the couch that day, wondering if I could go back to my job and if I could do this, or if I wanted to do this wild thing and become a wedding planner and a business owner, sitting back and going back to that moment, I’m so glad that I chose to do something that was really risky and scary because looking back, you know, 15 years later, I am in such a great place.

And I’m just so proud of 26, 27 year old me who had no idea what they were getting themselves into.

Akua: Oh my gosh. I have just loved everything about this conversation. It’s just been so inspiring and I just really appreciate you both for coming back on this show and just being very transparent about your business and where you’re at.

And, uh, this conversation has been great and for people listening, I hope this makes it hopeful. I hope you feel hopeful after listening to this of like, there is no wrong way to do entrepreneurship. You just have to truly lean into you, who you are and forge your own path. And so you both know every, every episode, we love to end with the question.

What do you think is the biggest differentiator between the businesses that succeed and the ones that fail? Michael, I’ll have you go first.

Dr. Michael Tatonetti: Oh, I got to pick something different. Um, cause I said audacity last time.

Akua: Oh, you did.

Dr. Michael Tatonetti: I did. I did. I did. You know what? No, I got to stick with audacity. I got to be honest.

Cause even as I listened to this podcast myself as a listener and I hear what everybody says, it all circles back to audacity still for me. So I think it’s having the audacity to bet on yourself and, uh, to Candace’s point saying, I like, I can do this. If why, why not me? Why can’t I be in the 50 percent that do it versus the 50 percent who don’t.

So I think it’s audacity to believe in yourself, to charge the rate, to learn what you need to learn and to, because you’re going to, this is one thing I have We are getting older, no matter what. So you might as well do the things. Don’t put it off. Do the things that scare you. You’re going to turn 30, whatever, anyway.

So build the life that you want today. Like this is your opportunity. So audacity.

Akua: Yes, what’s a good reminder regardless? You know what I mean? Like we need to hear that have the audacity Candice what about you?

Candice Coppola: Oh my gosh. I love love audacity I think that you’re hit the nail on the head with that. You need to have a dad you got to take risks You just got to be Ruthless and how you pursue and have faith in yourself.

I love that. I wonder what I said last time. I don’t remember But I’ll go the strategic route. I’ll I was like trying to remember

Akua: like what did she say? I’ll go the

Candice Coppola: strategic route. I have mentored tons And tons of business owners. And I think the business owners that succeed in the long haul are people that know their numbers and they’re not scared of money.

And they really spend the time to try to understand what they don’t know around finances and sales and pricing and how much things cost and their revenue and their spending. It’s the most unsexiest thing, but. Also, it’s very sexy. Once you start going into it and you know this stuff, you’re like, damn, I’m a boss, I’m making money.

Or you get really angry. You’re like, why did I spend like 4, 000 on this stupid thing? This is so, so dumb. Either way, the business owners that succeed are the people who are not scared to learn about numbers and about money. It has to be a priority as a business owner, because. There’s no accounting department that you can, that gets to just like check in on all the stuff in the business.

Like in corporate America, you are the accounting department,

Akua: so you need

Candice Coppola: to know your numbers. It’s really important. And also it’s not easy, but it’s

Akua: important. It is, but it’s good. It just empowers you as an entrepreneur. Cause I’m telling when I, and I’ve shared this before, if like my first year in business, when I got hit with the IRS best believe afterward, I’ve been checking them accounts and making sure.

I’m freaking out into

Candice Coppola: a sweat. Like I, Oh my goodness. Let me tell you this. Let me tell you, they know where you live. I moved. I moved, they sent me a letter, like seven days after they moved, they were like, Hey, they’re like, Hey, how are you? We know where you live. Just so you know. Hi. Just

Akua: so you know, uh, you’re gonna, you’re gonna pay us on time.

I was like, okay. But that is so cool. So, so true, like knowing your numbers and it’s not sexy at the beginning, but it does get a lot easier and you do, you feel empowered where you’re like, Oh, I made this much. Or again, you learn of like, okay, why did I spend this much amount of money? Okay. Lesson learned.

We’re definitely not going to do that. And I think again, it’s just, it truly. Helps you create a sustainable business, a business that’s going to be here tomorrow. And so I love that both of you. Thank you so much for this conversation. This has been absolutely amazing. I’m so glad that both of you decided to come back.

So thank you. And for people that want to connect with you, Candace, how can we support you?

Candice Coppola: I would love to connect with you. I love all my fellow independent honey bookers. You are my people. I’ve been a honey book member for, since the beginning, the very beginning. You can find me at my website, Candace Coppola.

com. And that links to my podcast, YouTube, Instagram, all the places that I also reside on the internet.

Akua: Yes. And shameless plug, go check out her podcast. Cause I was on the show. We had a time. A time was had. We had

Candice Coppola: so much fun. It was It’s such a great episode.

Akua: Such a good episode. So much fun. So definitely you guys go check it out and Michael, where can people find you and connect with you?

Dr. Michael Tatonetti: Yeah, I would say our website’s pricingforassociations. com, but otherwise really LinkedIn is the best for that peer to peer connection. So you can just look me up on LinkedIn, Dr. Michael Tatletti, and always happy to connect and meet new people and message and swap tips and answer any questions.

Akua: Yes. Oh my gosh.

Well, both of you, thank you so much for being here and for everyone until next time. Thank you so much for tuning in today’s episode. Candice and Michael shared so many amazing strategies that you can start implementing today in your business. Don’t forget to head to our description to download our 2025 growth guide and we’ll see you next time.

That ends our episode of the independent business podcast. Everything we’ve discussed today can be found at podcast. honeybook. com. Head to our website to access for show notes, relevant links, and all of the resources that you need to level up. And if you’ve enjoyed today’s episode, be sure to subscribe to the podcast to make sure you never miss our future content, drop us a review and leave our guests some love on social.

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